The Treatment of Atheist

[Ace Mercury]

In fact, I only know one.

How about solipsism? There aren't nearly enough solipsists.

[Bad Dragonite]

Who is he to say that what I believe, or lack in believing, is "sad"?

He is a person, that's who. He's entitled to an opinion, and has every right to voice that opinion at any given moment in time. You just have to grow up and deal.

Next time he says it, depending on my mood, I'm either going to find a way to make him discontinue ever saying that again in a very blatant and rather mean way, or just stop being his friend.

Go ahead, if he's a true Christian he'll probably appreciate it. It'll hurt losing a friend, and he'll be saddened by the fact that he couldn't lead you to foot of a blood stained cross by himself with God's help, but he'll know that if he suffers in this life because of the name of Jesus Christ that he'll have eternal life and riches in Heaven. And he'll also realize that by you no longer being his friend or being around him that God has you moving to a new phase in your life, and your friend's part in God's plan for your life is done for now.

Him even implying that it's "sad" is completely disrespectful and totally closed-minded.

You implying that you're no longer going to be his friend and saying that you'll force him to stop voicing his own opinion about you being an atheist because your somewhat offended by and/or disagree with it shows the same thing of yourself.


Seriously, the fact that you're offended doesn't mean anything. I could turn on a radio, a television, a computer, or even open up a book and be offended dozens of times by what I see/read/hear. If I'm talking to someone and they say something on a specific subject that is opposite to my own opinion, I don't get offended, I give my opinion and possibly try to get them to change to my opinion while also listening to their opinion with an open mind, open heart, and open ears. Taking offense at someone's opinion is childish, unhealthy, unappealing, and unnecessary. Not to mention it shows just how close minded you are. And taking offense (especially because someone else doesn't agree with you) is counterproductive as well as a waste of time and energy. People have different thoughts and beliefs, that's just how it is. You can't force anyone to do anything. You just have to give your side and hope they at least listen. If you are offended by what your friend says, then either don't hang out with him, or if he's not willing to change, but you still want to be his friend, then just deal with it or better yet, be the better person and change for him instead by accepting that he has his opinion and talk to him about your own. Ask him about his opinions as well, and above all don't get angry or offended when he doesn't agree with you.

Also, people do sometimes ask others what religion the people around them are, but the reason probably everyone in my grade knows that I'm atheist is because [color= "red"]I used to be Christian[/color] and attend a group called Awanas, wear many of my peers also used to go to, and when i stopped going they asked me why, which was followed by me responding with the fact that I am indeed a non-believer.

Just claiming Christianity and going to a group doesn't make you a Christian. Just thought I'd get that point across as well.

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Another thing, the fact that your friend is willing to say, "That's sad." means that he thinks of you as a good friend and trusts you. I know I wouldn't say anything like that to any stranger, but I'm willing to be quasi-rude in my speech to close friends. Just thought I'd point that out to.


I'll keep you and your friend in my prayers.
God bless!


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P.S. If anyone begins attempting to have an argument with me, I should tell you that I probably won't reply. Partly because of lack of interweb at home. Partly because I'll most likely forget about this topic by the time I get a chance to reply, and also partly because I don't like arguing. If I remember and someone does reply to this then I'll try to reply, but I can't guarantee I'll give a rebuttal. :/

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-Dated Friday, June 04, 2010.

[LOOT]

^ Completely. Missing. The point. I can't even reply to that, it's making my blood boil.

[The Spark]

Oh and i might add that he says he's christian, but actually knows nothing about anything involving christianity, nor do i think he has ever even opened the Bible. I probably should've added this. Also i noticed I said "wear" instead of "where", I meant "where". My bad.

[CaptHayfever]

-Dated Friday, June 04, 2010.

Why did you wait to post this until 2 weeks after you wrote it?

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

[The Spark]

I forgot.

[CaptHayfever]

^I was asking Guild (hence the quote), not you.

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

[Deepfake]

Longlonglonglong

Dude, you're not getting it, because you're not seeing every side. There are more effective ways to reach a person than to condescend, and if you are willing to condescend then you are making an open display of disregard for the other person. This situation was an example of that, even if the Spark is condescending in her own way. There are plenty of ways to act about that. Beside that, any open-minded person, including practicing Christians, can tell you there are entirely legitimate reasons not to believe. That is the point of the concept of faith. It does not appeal in rational terms, it is not rational, you are practicing something meta beyond rationality that evaluates rationality as of lesser necessity than belief.

That much should've been obvious when you started believing in a hyper-existing omnipotence.

Honestly, it's kind of any atheist or agnostic's responsibility as a person who values rationality to be absolutely terrified of the ability of the human mind to operate outside the bounds of rational behavior, and to see religious beliefs in part as an example of the pitfalls of human self-importance. That the Spark is willing to remain friends with someone despite what she must consider their immense and dangerous lack of insight shows either ignorance or effort on her behalf to sustain that friendship. That her friend would attempt to chisel away at that in some lame attempt to bring her over shows a lack of respect symptomatic of immature zealotry, and just how harmful that kind of belief can be to our ability to function together as a society.

[Sim Kid]

I always found it odd how merely not going to church somehow makes you an Atheist.

And not one of those Atheists who merely ignores organized religion in general - but one of those flaming "GOD IS DEAD!", "THE CHURCH IS EVIL!", "THE CHURCH IS BRAINWASHING!" and "GOD IS TAKING AWAY YOUR FREE WILL!", or even worse. Like you're somehow a Satanist. (When wouldn't you have to believe in the religion to some extent to even believe there's a Satan to worship in the first place?)

[Valigarmander]

^ Wicca and Voodoo have nothing at all to do with Satan or devil-worship, yet they're still associated with it.

[Metal Man]

He is a person, that's who. He's entitled to an opinion, and has every right to voice that opinion at any given moment in time. You just have to grow up and deal.

Why is he entitled to his opinion, but the OP not entitled to their own opinion that they are offended by that opinion?

Go ahead, if he's a true Christian he'll probably appreciate it. It'll hurt losing a friend, and he'll be saddened by the fact that he couldn't lead you to foot of a bllahasbaflahabsfklasfbasfsafjbbasf lasfj afs jbasf ljasfljasfbasflbasflasfb

Why do you make up such strange nonsense based upon so little information?

Seriously, the fact that you're offended doesn't mean anything. I could turn on a radio, a television, a computer, or even open up a book or eftbvebgegwubgwa

So why does the fact you appear to be bothered by them being offended mean anything?

Taking offense at someone's opinion is childish, unhealthy, unappealing, and unnecessary. Not to mention it shows just how close minded you are.

Why are you saying that when you just did what you said what was bad in your own post?

Another thing, the fact that your friend is willing to say, "That's sad." means that he thinks of you as a good friend and trusts you.

How do you know that? Where is this source of wisdom you claim to have?

P.S. If anyone begins attempting to have an argument with me, I should tell you that I probably won't reply. Partly because of lack of interweb at home. Partly because I'll most likely forget about this topic by the time I get a chance to reply, and also partly because I don't like arguing. If I remember and someone does reply to this then I'll try to reply, but I can't guarantee I'll give a rebuttal. :/

What's the point of saying all this if you aren't going to explain why you said it if questioned?

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-Dated Friday, June 04, 2010.

Why do we need to know this?

It just seems hypocritical to, on the one hand, criticize another for being offended, and then in the process, be offended by them being offended. Shouldn't you, then, by that same point, "Grow up and deal" with the OP being offended by his friend's conflict-inducing words?

[The Spark]

his

*cough*her*cough*

[CaptHayfever]

I always found it odd how merely not going to church somehow makes you an Atheist.

I wasn't aware that it did.

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

[Deepfake]

I always found it odd how merely not going to church somehow makes you an Atheist.

And not one of those Atheists who merely ignores organized religion in general - but one of those flaming "GOD IS DEAD!", "THE CHURCH IS EVIL!", "THE CHURCH IS BRAINWASHING!" and "GOD IS TAKING AWAY YOUR FREE WILL!", or even worse. Like you're somehow a Satanist. (When wouldn't you have to believe in the religion to some extent to even believe there's a Satan to worship in the first place?)

Ah, well if you were addressing me, I'm just operating on the assumption that Spark is an atheist. I also don't think religion is inherently evil or anything like that, I'm just pointing out that it leads to incongruities of interest that an atheist would have to work around as equally as an invested Christian, on the subject of friendship. Atheism represents an active disbelief. If you've simply got no cause for faith or participation, you're not really an atheist or agnostic. Agnosts come in a wide variety as well. If you were an intentional agnostic, what I said should apply. If you're simply not a religious participant, then you're not really either, although you can fit a broad definition of atheist, depending on how the language is interpreted. I do not interpret it this way.

Random house defines atheism as:
the doctrine or belief that there is no god.

What you're talking about is a lack of belief in god. Not a belief in the lack of god. Varieties of the lack of belief in god can fall under agnosticism.

Random House defines agnosticism as:
an intellectual doctrine or attitude affirming the uncertainty of all claims to ultimate knowledge.

This means that you must have an invested attitude. If you're neither of these things, then you simply are not an atheist or agnostic, in my mind.




BTW, on the subject of the earlier discussion about MM's inability to associate with a group containing unsavory elements, I think it's completely in the wrong to consider something like atheism to be a group participation. It's more of the antithesis of group participation. If you can find commonalities in the wide varieties of atheists, it's just that human element of pattern-finding that makes us both so brilliant and so easily misled at play.

[Metal Man]

*cough*her*cough*

Whoops.

I always seem to get people's genders wrong on the internet. Something about knowing the true gender of many of the fake girls causes me to mess up elsewhere for no reason.

[Bad Dragonite]

Gonna read over this and see if I can't work out some replies.

To answer Capt. I have no internet (Hoping ATT sends me the disk by Monday so the dial-up caan be activated), I just read over topics, type out a reply, then copy/paste it later. This is also my explanation for my unneeded dating. I just copy/pasted, and didn't care that it was still there.

Plus people's opinions on some subjects tend to change with time, and I wanted to get the record straight when exactly my opinion completely coincided with my post.

[Bad Dragonite]

Don't you own an actual one of those, A.I. ?

[About 6 or 7 P.M. July 4th 2010]

I never said that they weren't entitled to their own opinion of an opinion. I just said that they need to grow up and deal with the fact that other people have their own opinions, and to be offended by and angry/upset with someone because they have a differing opinion is foolish and counterproductive for everyone.
If she dislikes the friend's opinion to such a point then she should either not hang out with him any more, or (in my opinion the better choice) just deal with the fact that her friend has an opinion about her personal choices that she doesn't agree with.

Why do you make up such strange nonsense based upon so little information?

I'm not making anything up, this is basic Biblical teaching. Even if you're a non-believer, it is clear that the Bible gives guidlines for how a Christian should live.

Assuming he is an actual Christian, he would end up thinking in a similar manner to most Christians, and therefore would have an at least somewhat similar response to such a situation as this that most Christians would. I took what information I was given, and thought of what might be the most logical outcome.
Unless of course he were much less mature in his Christian walk (as I am now assuming he is with new information) in which case he would not know how a Christian should handle such a situation, and would most likely therefore handle it much differently.

Why are you saying that when you just did what you said what was bad in your own post?

This one was probably my fault, I should've said "becoming offended" rather than "taking offense at."
If this isn't the case and I did in fact communicate correctly, then I'm not sure what you mean or how I might respond.
All I can say is that I'm not offended by her opinion or any of her post really for that matter.

What's the point of saying all this if you aren't going to explain why you said it if questioned?

The same reason anyone says anything of true importance. To get a point across. When it comes to an important issue esspecially, I don't argue for argument's sake.

Why do we need to know this?

You don't. I've already explained the rest, so yeah.

I completely agree. That's why I'm not offended by it. I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that someone would end a friendship just because their friend had the audacity to convey any sort of, "bad" opinion about their life choices. But I'm in no way offended by it.

his[/strike]her friend's conflict-inducing words?

I've dealt with it by speaking my thoughts on the subject and NOT getting offended by it.


Honestly, according your post, you seem to either be instigating, or you just didn't get the message I was attempting convey.
If its the latter then I apologize for not conveying it well enough.


Either way, it may seem like I was offended or upset by this, but I wasn't. I was just pointing out that something like this:

FRIENDSHIP FALE[/b]

annoys me and seems dumb to me.



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I'm sorry. Please don't go into a coma or something on me, dude.

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[Gumchum]

I'm curious about how a young, practicing atheist knows whether or not someone knows, "anything involving Christianity."

First of all, just because someone is atheist doesn't mean they can't have a pretty good grip on what the Bible says. Secondly, how does one exactly "practice" atheism?

[Metal Man]

*Hurls AI's post at Falcon Keck*

Also, I have read the bible and taken two classes on it. Let's just say there's multiple sects of Christians and assuming they all should react the same way is... as foolish as getting angry at opinions for no reason.

[Bad Dragonite]

First of all, just because someone is atheist doesn't mean they can't have a pretty good grip on what the Bible says.

You're putting words into my mouth.
Don't do that, please.

I was asking on the assumption that she was a young atheist who stays as far away from the Bible, let alone what most of it actually means, as she can.

Perhaps my wording was off, or my assumption was misplaced or faulty, but I do not believe so.

Perhaps I should have worded it, "How do YOU know that he doesn't know anything about Christianity? Huh? HUH!?"

But I didn't want to come off as an immature ass.

Not even counting the fact that she IS an atheist, and therefore, probably doesn't know what it means to be a true Christian. Given that fact, I would say that she wouldn't truly be able to judge whether a confessing Christian "knows anything about Christianity," or not.

Secondly, how does one exactly "practice" atheism?

By practicing atheism, you're practicing a faith that there is no God.

Not necisarilly. You have a point, there are different sects of Christianity, and they would act at least somewhat differently, but you'reignoring the fact that I never said that he would act in exactly the same manner, I said I expected he might act in a somewhat similar manner, mostly because of the Biblical principles that guide the lives of many Christians. As well as the fact that if he was a true Christian, he would, in fact, have God's spirit within him that would help him react in a way that he should.

*Sidestep*